“A a lot of famous people are assholes,” he says Sandy Toksvig. “I don’t like people because they are famous or rich. My father was incredibly famous, the most famous person in Denmark. So I’ve seen it up close and have no interest in fame. I spoke with Toksvig – the distributor; quiz host; author of plays, musicals and about 30 books; pioneering feminist and LGBTQ+ activist – for her role as an officiant at the wedding of Abba’s Björn Ulvaeus to his partner Christina Sass in September. Ulveus is indeed famous and rich, but firmly “not in the ass category.” He is a good friend, very gentle and humanist like me.” Klaus Toksvig, who was a broadcaster and foreign correspondent – essentially Denmark’s answer to Richard Dimbleby – was also not in the ass category. He and his daughter were extremely close, and he took her on work trips, one of which, amazingly, included watching Neil Armstrong walk on the moon from the Apollo Mission Control Center in Houston.
That Klaus was so famous “should have sent me in the opposite direction,” Toksvig says, adding, “I didn’t set out to do what I did.” But while studying law, archeology and anthropology at Cambridge — her plan was to become a human rights lawyer – Toksvig joined Footlights, the university’s comedy society, “for laughs. And a director saw me and said, “Come work with me,” and I thought, “Okay, I’ll do it and treat it like another gap year.” And that was 45 years ago. I’m having the longest holiday year ever.”
Toksvig and I were supposed to meet in person at the British Library, but that plan fell through when I tripped and broke my leg, so we’re meeting on Zoom instead. Toksvig, 66, is filled with motherly warmth as she questions me about what happened; she calls everyone “darling” but it’s still lovely when it’s directed at you. Instead of talking about my failure, we’re here to discuss the upcoming Sandi Claus is Coming to Town, a one-off evening of music, dance and quirky storytelling at London’s Royal Albert Hall. The show is written by Toksvig, who also hosts and is directed by Stacey Haynes, with whom she worked on Mamma Mia! The party. Basically, it’s about a man named Albert – named after being left on the steps of the Albert Hall as a baby – who, raised by nuns, works in the hall arranging chairs for orchestras. We learn that Albert is a bachelor, lonely and looking for love, so Toksvig sets out to play Cupid.
The show will be “full of traditional Christmas stuff and have a happy ending,” she says. “And if the audience plays their part, as they are a big part of the show, we hope it snows in the Albert Hall.” The show will feature West End singer Carrie Hope Fletcher, organist Anna Lapud and Toksvig’s son Theo and daughter-in-law Maddie – although Toksvig can’t tell me what they’ll be doing because “it’s a surprise, probably even to them.”
This is, she adds, a show “for everyone. I always realize how lucky I am…especially at Christmas because I have this huge, warm, fun family and I adore every minute of it. But there are so many people who don’t have anyone, or who feel a little lonely or rejected by their community. So this is really about them.”
It will also feature the gay men’s choir, whom Toksvig considers “dear, dear friends” and who sang at her wedding to her partner Debbie, a psychotherapist, in 2014. Toksvig was presented by his daughter Megan and walked down the aisle as the choir sang I’m Getting Married in the Morning. The service was at London’s Royal Festival Hall on the day gay marriage was legalized (they had a civil partnership in 2007). Just over 150 guests were invited, although Toksvig let it be known that the public could attend if they wanted; eventually 2,000 people showed up.
Yet on this otherwise happy day, the couple had to have police protection after receiving death threats. This was not new. This happened after Toksvig came out as a lesbian in 1994. and it has continued to happen at intervals ever since. She notes that there was never any doubt about coming out, as she and her then-partner Peta Stewart “were not prepared for our children to grow up in the shadow of a secret. So even though there was pressure from the tabloid press, which was mean, I was perfectly willing to give up my career for the sake of honesty and so that my children could be proud of their parents.
It’s no wonder there’s an element of campaigning in much of Toksvig’s work, whether it’s featuring same-sex relationships in her prose – her latest book, Dorothy’s Friends, is a tongue-in-cheek account of a lesbian couple in search of a sperm donor – or as the genius host of the QI quiz show. In the latter role, she became the first woman to host a major BBC panel show. In 1990 she is in the running to host Have I Got News for You opposite Angus Deayton. “I still have a letter from [the show’s bosses] which reads: “We preferred you Sandy, but the BBC decided we couldn’t have a woman mocking the news.” Has the world changed since then? maybe I hope.”
Toksvig spent much of the last academic year leading a new research initiative at the University of Cambridge after receiving a fellowship from the Faculty of Sociology’s LGBTQ+ Research Programme. Part of her role is developing the Mappa Mundi project, a digital resource documenting the stories and achievements of women around the world. She says teaching is “probably one of my favorite things I’ve done in ages because I had to really think: What do I want to say? Many Cambridge freshmen just want to be good and do what they’re told. The [idea] is to challenge them and to awaken their consciousness, especially to awaken the feminist consciousness in the boys.”
Toksvig’s activism also led to her becoming a founding member of the Women’s Equality Party in 2015, but last month in a vote backed by leaders the party was disbanded. “In the current climate, a small political party is not the best vehicle for change,” she says. “And just running a party for its own sake or for sentiment is not the way we do things.” She remains proud of what they have achieved, especially the five survivors on domestic violence for Parliament in 2019 against five MPs who were accused of harassment or violence. “Four of them stood up and one went to jail. I don’t care that we didn’t win a place. These five men are no longer in Parliament and we have done the basic laundry service for Westminster.
She is saddened by the divide that has developed among feminists between those who support trans rights and those who argue that women’s spaces are threatened by them, and that the two sides “haven’t found a way to talk together… .-founded a party called the Women’s Equality Party. I do not qualify the word equality. I remember when same-sex marriage was being discussed and I heard a bishop say, “I think gays have enough equality,” and I thought, “Can we just discuss the use of the word enough?” So I can’t believe in equality and yes I think: “For you and for you, but not for you.” It doesn’t work that way.”
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Toksvig – who has four grandchildren – is fully convinced that what has gone wrong in today’s feminist discourse will be righted by the next generation. When she came out, she says, anti-gay bigotry was rampant and she had no role models. And “now the kids don’t care [about a person’s sexuality]. So we’ll find it a flash of prejudice and ignorance and move on. I have to believe that.
As a child, Toksvig was always on the move due to her father’s work, with the family settling in Europe, Africa and the US (her American accent still comes through after a few drinks). The peripatetic life taught young Sandy that “everywhere in the world there is something to be proud of and you have to arrive with your eyes open… I always say you don’t need money to travel. Get on the bus at the end of your journey and you’ll discover something you didn’t know before.” Her ever-curious, ready-made spirit is reflected in a career where “I’ve never looked for a job. I said yes to things.
Toksvig is aware that women her age remain a rare sight on television compared to her male peers and notes her “incredible luck” that her diary for next year is already full. “But we still have a lot in the media to look at. Like, why don’t we have a woman hosting a late-night chat show? Is it just that we can’t stay awake because of our cycles?’
Yet she’ll happily stop when something isn’t working, whether that’s shutting down the Women’s Equality Party or quitting a high-profile job on The Great British Bake Off, which she co-hosted for three years. Having already landed herself in hot water this year for saying she never liked the show, today she is coy about the subject but will say: “It wasn’t for me. I’m not one to sit and watch the meringue dry.”
Two years ago, she added a new skill to her resume: chainsaw operator. She and Debbie live in the middle of 40 acres of woodland in southern England (for security reasons they don’t reveal where they live) which has been neglected “for generations”. So, with the help of local friends and volunteers, they brought it back to life. Tired of being quoted exorbitant amounts by men with chainsaws, Toksvig decided to learn how to use one and took a course. Now, every Sunday, she’s out cutting trees: “I’m 66 years old and I have a chainsaw—and I can’t get enough of it.” Since they’ve been doing the work, the bells have doubled in the spring, the deer population has increased, and they rehomed animals from the local wildlife hospital. “Releasing a baby owl that has never flown before is one of the great joys of my life,” beams Toksvig.
Crucial to her well-being and happiness, she says, is not making television work as the be-all and end-all. “I have a wonderful family and have been grotesquely happily married for 18 years. So if you said to me, “It’s over now, Sandy, you have to go home now,” I’d say, “That’s great, thank you very much.” And I would go.
Sandy Claus is coming to town is on December 18 at the Royal Albert Hall, London. For more information visit royalberthall.com
